osCommerce - should I?
I've been out of the loop in osCommerce since a year ago. I've not visited the forum for over 1 year, and have had very few dealings with any osCommerce shops in that time. I did do 1 training session, and I did a small adjustment on a couple of osCommerce installs.
Since a year has gone by, I feel it's enough time to reacquaint myself with the osCommerce Forum - but I am loath to do so as I know that I am not welcome in there due to some comments made just before I left. However, since that time the 2 people who made those comments have now left (I know "Mattice" definitely has left, unsure about "Johnson" - could anyone confirm?). Of that old group of monkeys, only Harald is left, and I never really had a problem with him, though he did with me.
I am wondering if it is worth the effort of rejoining that community. MS3 Alpha has recently been released which I should get to grips with, but I don't want to spin my wheels and get nowhere (in terms of spending time to find yourself unwelcomed).
I guess the options are;
- Rejoin under my existing username and not get involved too much with helping people.
- Rejoin under my existing username and attempt to find out the problem Harald has (if he still has one). ANd go back to beig my usual helpful self.
- Join the community under a new username and start afresh.
- Don't bother and go with some other cart instead.
I know that a few of my readers/friends are still with osCommerce, so I ask, is osCommerce (forum and ethos) any better since a year ago?
Comment by Oli Allen — September 14, 2006 @ 11:05 am
What is it that attracts you to osC that doesn't apply to option 4?
Comment by HCG — September 14, 2006 @ 11:34 am
I'd personally go with option2, there is always going to be someone that has a problem with you, no matter what forum/community it is!
Just think that for every 1 person that doesn't like you there are probably 4 or 5 that are really grateful for your input and help!
Don't stop being yourself and hide behind a new username for someone else's sake!
x
Comment by Carine — September 14, 2006 @ 12:17 pm
Yes, Johnson left the building too.
I think if you are seriously looking at Release 3 (not MS3) alpha, you'll probably find there are still big areas to be improved and bugs to be fixed.
One area that you have addressed in the past being accessibility still needs work in the alpha release. If you can rally an effort up to adres this under an alpha SVN branch, I'm pretty sure Harald would welcome a helping hand. I have a client who really wants this (just going live on an MS2 accessible site) but I personally can't commit the time required to do this right now.
Maybe that is something up your sleeve ?
Comment by Richard — September 14, 2006 @ 1:57 pm
First comment. Oscommerce was the first shop I used and still is despite it is getting dated. I look at other carts but they are either no better, or suffer the same problems. Better the devil you know… Though I have hardly posted some of the people there had some very strange attitudes.
Now the new cart looks good but if it will ever see the light of day I have no idea. Plus when it does get out the forums are going to be flooded with thousands of requests for help as inexperience people try to install it and then wonder why a new piece of software does not work first time. So if go for option 2 prepare to be sunk under thousands of help requests.
Summary either 1 or 2, or go for 4 and spend the next year evaulating every single project.
Comment by Chance — September 14, 2006 @ 2:30 pm
I've set up a test ms3 alpha install on my server Here if you want to check it out.
I did start helping the team out, but I don't get into drama or ask questions about the past- I'm just there to help move things along for everybody.
Comment by burt — September 14, 2006 @ 2:39 pm
JC; I downloaded that Alpha Version and installed it without any real problems.
Carine; Can see it needs work on accessibility, so that might well be a good idea, thanks Carine.
Oli; the lack of a learning curve is probably the 1 (and only) reason. There would be a steeper learning curve with any other cart.
HCG; Good point.
Rich; This is the reason I didn't want to rejoin the forum as-is. With a history of helping people (to the detriment of my own business!) I did not want to rejoin at a time when there are going to be many hundreds of users wanting help. A bit selfish, I know, but there we are.
Maybe I will join the forum again sometime in the next few days and see how it goes.
Comment by Carine B — September 14, 2006 @ 7:27 pm
So you think the rel3 alpha will be easier to digest than other carts ?
hmmmm
It might look the same on the catalog side, but that is about it. Behind the scenes a lot is restructured and for the average newbee it will likely be a more difficult challenge to understand the workings and start modifying his/her shop, which is probably a good thing for professionals.
Comment by Dave J — September 14, 2006 @ 10:16 pm
I use the osc forums now and again and its as popular as ever - lots of new starters trying to get up and running. MS3 alpha seems to be a way off altho' several experienced developers are now offering assistance to Harald. I'm still not convinced it will get off the ground - porting all of the contribs to the new system will be a major headache for starters.
I also see a bunch of posts from guys I assume to be commercial developers - several of the posts don't seem over complimentary about the coding standards, accessibility etc so still some way to go with that.
I've not totally abandoned osc but for now JShop is getting my attention - not free but the new version is almost out in beta and is more accessible, css lay-out, template based etc. Also much better functionality than standard osc. Just my 2 cents…
Comment by Richard — September 14, 2006 @ 10:32 pm
Re: Being selfish,not really just not good business sense. I mean there is nothing wrong with giving some help freely (I often do in logistics) but if it is going to be a lot of work I charge. You can take it or leave it, we all have to eat. The problem is that the internet has brought this culture that as it is free everything associated with it should be as well and when you come well known in such a project you get the demands.Oscommerce is there to sell products and make you money and well if you need help desperately then you should expect have to pay, if you cannot maybe you should not be in business?
I don't know if MS3 will result in increase in business for web professionals, more likely there will be thousands of half baked oscommerce shops dotted around the web(no change there then!)
Now back to the more pressing matters of these herbal product websites!
Comment by burt — September 15, 2006 @ 4:57 pm
Would I be correct in assuming that the "no commercial developers here attitude" has been relaxed? I see a few users with links to their own oscommerce services; example
Comment by Dave J — September 15, 2006 @ 7:50 pm
Funny that - I tracked back to that site and had a good nosey around earlier this week (looks like she can code but some of the designs are not my cup of tea :))
"Monika von Allemange" is a regular poster and has a few contribs to her name. I saw a few posts from guys I assumed to be pro developers in the MS3 beta forums (and elsewhere) but can't recall if they were touting their services - sorry.
Chip back in there and see what happens - we still get a bunch of enquiries that come from old store examples we posted way back. Seems they find their way back to our main site via links from those sites. The osc forum is a good source of potential work if store building is still of interest.
Comment by Robr — September 19, 2006 @ 2:55 pm
I still think osCommerce is a great product that lends itself to being your own personality. As far as the forums are concerned there is definitely a holier than thou attitude but if you take it with a pinch of salt then……
I personally check the forums every week or so and try and offer my two penneth but there seems to be someone who always tries and go one better. C'est la vie.
Personally I miss the original people there when I started in 2003, Burt, Chance, Chemo etc.
You should consider option 1 as your comments where always welcomed by me.
Robr
Comment by Daniel Kerr — September 20, 2006 @ 10:21 am
osC ms3 has been in the works now for over 3 years. The all thats changed since ms2.2 is that the code is becoming more bloated and overly complicated.
If you are a web developer who is setting up shops for clients all the time and customizing features you will find osC is a really pain. The shop also looks very ugly and needs a template before it can be used.
The only good thing about osC is the community behind it.
Comment by Pidea — September 20, 2006 @ 12:45 pm
Good job I just stopped by as I'm about to start work in my spare time for a friend on an OsCommerce-based shop. I say OsCommerce-based because it's actually a fork called CRELoaded.
Apart from JShop, are there are any other carts that people would recommend ? How about ZenCart - is that any good ?
Comment by brushwood — October 5, 2006 @ 1:38 pm
Good to find you again! I've wondered what you have been doing. I, too have spent little time with osC lately, but only because I've been busy making my store a success. I go back now and then to give a little back to the group and see what's new in Contribs. I don't think 3 will ever happen. There's just no momentum. I have seen Bobby back there, by the way. he uses another name, but I do know it's him (no, not just a guess. it's him).
I was really hoping Project X would take off. Bobby has some brilliance but isn't a business leader. Maybe you could rally a group and launch something?
What about throwing your hat in with one of the forks? The code is similar enough. I looked at Zen for the first time recently and liked it on first inspection. Don't know fully since i didn't drive it hard or anything. Imagine if the 10 best coders from osC forums landed in Zen. The results could be awesome. (Maybe there are issues with it that I don't know. Just seems like a good idea on the surface)
Comment by burt — October 5, 2006 @ 1:59 pm
Hiya Dan. The Project X debacle could have been better handled by Bobby - that project will never fly as far as I can see. Unfortunately.
Putting my efforts into a fork is an idea, but seems pointless - most of them are as bad, if not worse than osCommerce. I still haven't been back to the osCommerce forum yet, maybe I will do in the next few weeks or so, just to see what's happening.
I did consider paying a coder to sit down for a month and rewrite osCommerce, once a base is in place it would be quite easy to gather a bunch of good coders/team leaders and move on from there…
Comment by RL2000 — October 13, 2006 @ 1:22 pm
Hi burt
I've seen a lot of your posts on the osC forumns and I think you have been a great asset to the community. So why not become one again? Noones forcing you to answer every single post, but you could really be and asset there.
Comment by Ryan Hobbs (aka hobbzilla) — October 14, 2006 @ 8:05 pm
Burt, I would say option 1. Only because that is what I have myself deliberated with. I lack the time, resources to help as many people as I did when I first found osC. I too was banned (I think 3 different times) by various members of the team with Harald always reinstating my status. I hit a nerve with my Multi-Stores "loaded" project as it was considered a fork just like CRE, etc. etc. IMHO, it is really sad that Harald hasn't taken the reigns of the project and relequished control to a team of developers.. I doubt osC 3 beta will be out by June 07 with the final release no earlier than Sept. of 2007. I think that may be a record for an open source project with it's following.
I personally have a renewed interst in oscommerce as I have just started a business venture with 2 other partners that will get me back coding with MS2. I too have installed 3alpha3 and according to the project plan, it actually looks like they are going to incorporate the Gift Voucher / Coupon code… Ian must be laughing..
-Hobbzilla